Champions League - Europa League - Conference League

[Salvatore Matrecano]

I don't know if it's true or not but a Palace fan has put a picture of the referee assignment for their Conference League qualifier first leg and the officials are all from Greece.  :Funny:

Now who would possibly get the blame for that?

[Tricky]

I don't know if it's true or not but a Palace fan has put a picture of the referee assignment for their Conference League qualifier first leg and the officials are all from Greece.  :Funny:

:Up Yours: :Up Yours: :Up Yours:

[Paplane]

I don't know if it's true or not but a Palace fan has put a picture of the referee assignment for their Conference League qualifier first leg and the officials are all from Greece.  :Funny:

Now who would possibly get the blame for that?

 Lets just hope that ref isnt fat. Or a c**t.

[Notts Nuts]

Parish, their owner/chairman/CEO (whatever he is), took the investment off Textor in the first place. He allowed the guy to buy into his club. Here's a Parish quote at the time:

"We have been looking for the right investment for the right investor for a while, both to progress the club and deal with the significant financial challenges of the past 18 months due to COVID"

So he took Textor's money to get Palace through the Covid period. Did it not occur to him at the time that he might need to impose a restriction on Textor buying another European club while holding Palace shares, or was he just so desperate to get the cash he took whatever deal was on offer? If you introduce people onto your board, do you not have discussions beforehand about matters such as these?

I’ll answer both of the last posts here, if I may. I think it’s misguided to attack Parish and Palace because they were powerless to affect this, even if they believed they were part of an MCO, even by UEFA’s illogical reasoning or that an arbitrary date applied to them, but not to others. Forest fans, along with any others like Simon Jordan, get criticised for failing to understand that. They also get criticised for the hypocrisy involved in defending the fig leaf of a whitewash that UEFA have allowed to disguise those who truly are MCO’s. Proper fans can see that whichever club they support and defending the indefensible does Forest no favours in the wider football community. 

Rules might be rules but they aren’t laws and any rule that fails to achieve its stated purpose runs the risk of being declared unlawful by a Court and compensation awarded for consequential losses. The problem here being that every club has to agree to the rules on joining so it would take a clever lawyer to work out the strategy. 

Aside from that it seems obvious that Palace and their lawyers must have had sight of the correspondence between OL and UEFA and Forest and UEFA. You wouldn’t hame them a co-respondents otherwise. It is known that there are factions within UEFA, one of whom is sympathetic to Palace’s case. That correspondence was requested to be disclosed and for witnessed to be cross examined. This was refused. It wouldn’t be in a Court. 

So Palace fans also criticise Forest fans for thinking this is all down to a schoolboy error by Parish when it’s very much more complicated than that. The integrity of football is in play here, which is something we should all agree about, putting rivalry aside. 

Yes, during Covid, Parish welcomed Textor’s investment but at the time Palace were the only club he had any interest in and it had been agreed he would hold limited voting rights. OL came later and caused them to fall out, for Textor to first try to acquire the whole club, then buy Everton before deciding to sell. Parish is passionately opposed to the whole idea of MCO in football. The fans were always suspicious about Textor and have made several protests about him. Parish is foremost a fan. He is at one with them. Unlike some Chairmen. 

I trust that’s reasonable enough and that the rhetoric can now be tuned out.

So why was Parish blaming Forest? Or are you just going to ignore that bit again? Do you believe that is acceptable for him to blame Marinakis?

Why do you think Parish was blaming Forest? I haven’t ignored it because he hasn’t. Not yet! The club requested the disclosure of the correspondence between UEFA and Forest but it wasn’t produced. It would be in Court proceedings. Why, if there is nothing to hide, wasn’t it produced? If entirely innocent it would end speculation and remove suspicion, whether it needed to or not. It could be done tomorrow but I bet it won’t. My guess is that Palace have either got a copy or know what it contains. Lawyers don’t request things they don’t already have. 

Marinakis has previous. It’s natural to be distrustful of those with such a reputation.

Firstly, you are wrong in your comment that Parish hasnt blamed Forest for the situation you have found yourselves in. Parish, on Gary Linekers podcast when asked said  “Yes. We were told that and I think it’s been made public. These things seem to be played out in public. There doesn’t seem to be a lot of confidentiality that comes out of certain organisations. But we’re led to believe that that’s the issue – if there wasn’t somebody that wanted to get in as a consequence, then there wouldn’t be a problem". 

He was told what exactly and by whom? Some journalist heard Forest had asked UEFA where they stood in relation to the uncertainty surrounding the Palace case and decided to twist it to make out Forest had somehow forced UEFA into making a decision that would only benefit Forest? For Christs sake, if you believe that, then sadly my friend, you are as delusional as Parish is himself! The fact is, Palace were already facing the ban from the EL before Forest sent their letter in, so the notion that somebody wanting to get in as caused the problem is quite frankly absurd. 

If Palace have a copy of this alleged correspondence, why didnt Palace lawyers produce it at the initial UEFA hearing, or subsequently at the Court of Arbitration for Sport, who were there to rule whether UEFA had followed the rules correctly? Quite simply because there is no correspondence that in any way, shape or form drags Forest or Marinakis into the matter. Quite frankly, I dont know what went on at either the UEFA hearing or the CAS tribunal anymore than you do.

Finally, you say Marinakis has previous. Previous what exactly? Yes he has been mentioned in a number of legal cases in his native Greece, including match fixing, bombing a referees bakery and so on, but guess what? He has been cleared of all of the afore mentioned activities. These charges were brought against him by owners of other clubs in Greece, where there is a far more dangerous under current to anything we see in this country. A lot of what goes on in Greece actually is more political than it is about football. But dont let the truth get in the way of idle, wild and totally inaccurate accusations that you feel compelled to level at us on a Forest forum. 

I dont understand why Parish isnt directing his anger at Textor and not at Marinakis. Textor is the one that shafted your club in the first place, so it makes perfect sense to me that he should be the one in Parish's sights. Or maybe Textor holds the truth about the MCO Palace claim they are not or were not a part of. Time will tell.

The level of ignorance in this thread is both staggering and shameful. Many of the posts can be ignored, coming as they do from the quite obviously myopic or delusional. Such people exist in every fan base. Some though project such a high level of disinformation, or misunderstanding, that they demand correction, because not everyone is quite so stupid. The above being one.

Parish has never blamed Forest. He has questioned what their letter sought to achieve and requested it be made available to CAS. Which was refused. Whether he has a copy, or was simply informed of its existence, isn’t known but you cannot introduce a leaked copy yourself and hearsay evidence isn’t admissible. You need to ask yourself why, if the letter was merely seeking clarification, it wasn’t willingly and immediately made public, or not given to CAS. What was made public was that there was a letter sent, with the claim of it requesting clarification. Not the letter itself. Why does this matter? Because it is suggested that pressure has been corruptly applied within UEFA by one faction to get the rules applied to the letter, rather than find the workaround that others wanted because of the unique situation that had evolved, in which one club, who are clearly not part of a MCO were being replaced by another which clearly is. 

There are lots of rumours that Marinakis has, like many of his ilk, successfully harvested plausible deniability. Just as Trump, and Al Capone before him, have done in the USA. Capone only eventually being jailed on tax evasion charges. If you have never read this, I suggest you do. I have a Greek friend, from Athens, who assures me it all, and much more, is true. Dismiss it if you cannot face the questions but generally speaking smoke without fire doesn’t exist. At the very least there are many unanswered questions about a not very nice man who has a reported record of buying favour. Which he seems to have achieved again at Forest. 

If these accusations are wild then take them up with the publisher of the New Republic, who might just know rather more than football fans more blinkered than any horse at Aintree. 

Parish isn’t directing anger anywhere. He is calmly trying to decide, at each stage, what is needed to rectify a wrong that neither he, nor the club, had any part in creating. Textor could well face action for failing, as a Director, to act in the club’s best interests. UEFA much less likely and Forest almost certainly not. Time will indeed tell.

[Sausage Roll]

Stop making new accounts you boring twerp. Sniff is it possible to ban IP addresses because this bozo is getting tedious now.

[Marinakis Red]

I’ll answer both of the last posts here, if I may. I think it’s misguided to attack Parish and Palace because they were powerless to affect this, even if they believed they were part of an MCO, even by UEFA’s illogical reasoning or that an arbitrary date applied to them, but not to others. Forest fans, along with any others like Simon Jordan, get criticised for failing to understand that. They also get criticised for the hypocrisy involved in defending the fig leaf of a whitewash that UEFA have allowed to disguise those who truly are MCO’s. Proper fans can see that whichever club they support and defending the indefensible does Forest no favours in the wider football community. 

Rules might be rules but they aren’t laws and any rule that fails to achieve its stated purpose runs the risk of being declared unlawful by a Court and compensation awarded for consequential losses. The problem here being that every club has to agree to the rules on joining so it would take a clever lawyer to work out the strategy. 

Aside from that it seems obvious that Palace and their lawyers must have had sight of the correspondence between OL and UEFA and Forest and UEFA. You wouldn’t hame them a co-respondents otherwise. It is known that there are factions within UEFA, one of whom is sympathetic to Palace’s case. That correspondence was requested to be disclosed and for witnessed to be cross examined. This was refused. It wouldn’t be in a Court. 

So Palace fans also criticise Forest fans for thinking this is all down to a schoolboy error by Parish when it’s very much more complicated than that. The integrity of football is in play here, which is something we should all agree about, putting rivalry aside. 

Yes, during Covid, Parish welcomed Textor’s investment but at the time Palace were the only club he had any interest in and it had been agreed he would hold limited voting rights. OL came later and caused them to fall out, for Textor to first try to acquire the whole club, then buy Everton before deciding to sell. Parish is passionately opposed to the whole idea of MCO in football. The fans were always suspicious about Textor and have made several protests about him. Parish is foremost a fan. He is at one with them. Unlike some Chairmen. 

I trust that’s reasonable enough and that the rhetoric can now be tuned out.

So why was Parish blaming Forest? Or are you just going to ignore that bit again? Do you believe that is acceptable for him to blame Marinakis?

Why do you think Parish was blaming Forest? I haven’t ignored it because he hasn’t. Not yet! The club requested the disclosure of the correspondence between UEFA and Forest but it wasn’t produced. It would be in Court proceedings. Why, if there is nothing to hide, wasn’t it produced? If entirely innocent it would end speculation and remove suspicion, whether it needed to or not. It could be done tomorrow but I bet it won’t. My guess is that Palace have either got a copy or know what it contains. Lawyers don’t request things they don’t already have. 

Marinakis has previous. It’s natural to be distrustful of those with such a reputation.

Firstly, you are wrong in your comment that Parish hasnt blamed Forest for the situation you have found yourselves in. Parish, on Gary Linekers podcast when asked said  “Yes. We were told that and I think it’s been made public. These things seem to be played out in public. There doesn’t seem to be a lot of confidentiality that comes out of certain organisations. But we’re led to believe that that’s the issue – if there wasn’t somebody that wanted to get in as a consequence, then there wouldn’t be a problem". 

He was told what exactly and by whom? Some journalist heard Forest had asked UEFA where they stood in relation to the uncertainty surrounding the Palace case and decided to twist it to make out Forest had somehow forced UEFA into making a decision that would only benefit Forest? For Christs sake, if you believe that, then sadly my friend, you are as delusional as Parish is himself! The fact is, Palace were already facing the ban from the EL before Forest sent their letter in, so the notion that somebody wanting to get in as caused the problem is quite frankly absurd. 

If Palace have a copy of this alleged correspondence, why didnt Palace lawyers produce it at the initial UEFA hearing, or subsequently at the Court of Arbitration for Sport, who were there to rule whether UEFA had followed the rules correctly? Quite simply because there is no correspondence that in any way, shape or form drags Forest or Marinakis into the matter. Quite frankly, I dont know what went on at either the UEFA hearing or the CAS tribunal anymore than you do.

Finally, you say Marinakis has previous. Previous what exactly? Yes he has been mentioned in a number of legal cases in his native Greece, including match fixing, bombing a referees bakery and so on, but guess what? He has been cleared of all of the afore mentioned activities. These charges were brought against him by owners of other clubs in Greece, where there is a far more dangerous under current to anything we see in this country. A lot of what goes on in Greece actually is more political than it is about football. But dont let the truth get in the way of idle, wild and totally inaccurate accusations that you feel compelled to level at us on a Forest forum. 

I dont understand why Parish isnt directing his anger at Textor and not at Marinakis. Textor is the one that shafted your club in the first place, so it makes perfect sense to me that he should be the one in Parish's sights. Or maybe Textor holds the truth about the MCO Palace claim they are not or were not a part of. Time will tell.

The level of ignorance in this thread is both staggering and shameful. Many of the posts can be ignored, coming as they do from the quite obviously myopic or delusional. Such people exist in every fan base. Some though project such a high level of disinformation, or misunderstanding, that they demand correction, because not everyone is quite so stupid. The above being one.

Parish has never blamed Forest. He has questioned what their letter sought to achieve and requested it be made available to CAS. Which was refused. Whether he has a copy, or was simply informed of its existence, isn’t known but you cannot introduce a leaked copy yourself and hearsay evidence isn’t admissible. You need to ask yourself why, if the letter was merely seeking clarification, it wasn’t willingly and immediately made public, or not given to CAS. What was made public was that there was a letter sent, with the claim of it requesting clarification. Not the letter itself. Why does this matter? Because it is suggested that pressure has been corruptly applied within UEFA by one faction to get the rules applied to the letter, rather than find the workaround that others wanted because of the unique situation that had evolved, in which one club, who are clearly not part of a MCO were being replaced by another which clearly is. 

There are lots of rumours that Marinakis has, like many of his ilk, successfully harvested plausible deniability. Just as Trump, and Al Capone before him, have done in the USA. Capone only eventually being jailed on tax evasion charges. If you have never read this, I suggest you do. I have a Greek friend, from Athens, who assures me it all, and much more, is true. Dismiss it if you cannot face the questions but generally speaking smoke without fire doesn’t exist. At the very least there are many unanswered questions about a not very nice man who has a reported record of buying favour. Which he seems to have achieved again at Forest. 

If these accusations are wild then take them up with the publisher of the New Republic, who might just know rather more than football fans more blinkered than any horse at Aintree. 

Parish isn’t directing anger anywhere. He is calmly trying to decide, at each stage, what is needed to rectify a wrong that neither he, nor the club, had any part in creating. Textor could well face action for failing, as a Director, to act in the club’s best interests. UEFA much less likely and Forest almost certainly not. Time will indeed tell.

Cry more.

[Sausage Roll]

Can we stop quoting the thread when posting please? I've muted all this idiot's accounts and really don't want to see anything they've posted.

[Paplane]

Can we stop quoting the thread when posting please? I've muted all this idiot's accounts and really don't want to see anything they've posted.

I'm worried about the guy's mental wellbeing to be honest. It's as if he been absolutely gripped by this issue, he can't let it go and it's eating him up.

[Sausage Roll]

Some Palace fans do seem to have succumbed to the cult of Parish and believe he can't do anything wrong. When in reality he's a slimy, snivelling turd who should be apologising to Palace fans for his ineptitude rather than stringing them along with his self-pitying statements.

[stirred]

I’m not reading any more of these, it’s really quite pathetic and there is no genuine attempt at reason, I suggest nobody rises to the bait. I also suspect AI is being used here. The only thing I wonder is whether anyone reads other clubs fans forums and whether this campaign is going on at other clubs. I think a very sad individual is using ChatGPT or another LLM to try to persuade(?!) / annoy our fans, and wonder if this is a campaign being waged on other clubs forums / internet sites. At least I hope it’s an individual and not anything sanctioned by Crystal Palace, because it would probably be quite easy for an IT expert to trace the source and would (should) be a huge embarrassment if this came from them.

Either way, very very sad. Someone needs a girlfriend.

[Paplane]

I’m not reading any more of these, it’s really quite pathetic and there is no genuine attempt at reason, I suggest nobody rises to the bait. I also suspect AI is being used here. The only thing I wonder is whether anyone reads other clubs fans forums and whether this campaign is going on at other clubs. I think a very sad individual is using ChatGPT or another LLM to try to persuade(?!) / annoy our fans, and wonder if this is a campaign being waged on other clubs forums / internet sites. At least I hope it’s an individual and not anything sanctioned by Crystal Palace, because it would probably be quite easy for an IT expert to trace the source and would (should) be a huge embarrassment if this came from them.

Either way, very very sad. Someone needs a girlfriend.

Or a pot noodle.  :OMG:

[BadDog]

Can we stop quoting the thread when posting please? I've muted all this idiot's accounts and really don't want to see anything they've posted.

I'm worried about the guy's mental wellbeing to be honest. It's as if he been absolutely gripped by this issue, he can't let it go and it's eating him up.

It's AI I'm pretty sure, its just copy and pasted bullshit to wind us up OR the guys lost it.